2D Boy

It's available on Steam for $10 or DRM free cross platform from https://2dboy.com/. I believe there is also a mobile version? Correct me if I'm wrong.

To teach them basic concept of coding you can always let them play Human Resource Machine, Android/iOS/Windows game created by World of Goo studio http://2dboy.com/

I've mentioned this before, but World of Goo did everything right: great game, 90 on Metacritic, easy purchase through Steam or direct from their website, no DRM at all, and priced at $19.99. But an estimated 90% of players were on pirated versions of the game: http://2dboy.com/2008/11/13/90/. Is there something else they could have done?

Your point is valid, but it is still worth noting that a huge audience also did buy their game. They just sold their millionth game on the App Store alone. http://2dboy.com/2012/01/09/one-million-downloads/

I think at least for the initial startup period it would be a good idea to rely on Paypal or some similar service. The hassle of getting a merchant account might in some cases eat up too much of the founder(s)' precious time. Some successful retailers (like this indie game one: http://2dboy.com/games.php) continue rely on Paypal though they have a large user base. I think the best time to get a merchant account would be once the sales start rising above something like 10K/month or so. In that way, you'll (hopefully) have an account before your sales (again hopefully) hits 100K or so.

It's not DRM that matters. I pirate almost all the content I have, except for PC games. Why? Because Steam is just that good. It makes it so easy to purchase, install and update games, and connect with friends. I just checked my account - I have almost 90 games in Steam. And yet I can't remember the last time I purchased a movie or song. Let me know when Netflix and Spotify have improved their selections greatly (and Netflix has everything it can in full 1080p with surround sound), I'll be willing to pay then. Edit: the parent (username "citricsquid") just deleted his post (screenshot: http://i.imgur.com/yQiir.png). Here is the text in its entirety: > That quote is such bullshit, it's the most obnoxious pandering around. Yes, if you reduce the prices of your content and increase availability you'll sell more, but the fact is no matter how cheap you price your content and no matter how easy acquisition is people will still pirate it. Steam is in a very good position, it has so much good will (what some might characterize as circle jerking) around it that people buy from Steam just to validate their views on piracy. > "Steam is so successful because they are so great about piracy! That's why I buy from them!" but then when another company takes a much better approach to DRM than Steam (eg: release their content DRM free at a very reasonable price and available everywhere) people will suddenly forget all this "service problem" stuff and pirate it without a second thought. >…

Whenever I read a comment like yours I get this feeling that people like you are: A) Either Astroturfing on behalf of content publishers OR B) You are taking a moralistic stance that is completely unrealistic not unlike a grown man chastising another for watching Porn and/or going to a strip club, by preaching about sanctity of love/marriage. And whenever I read comments like yours, I facepalm. Accusations of astroturfing? Preaching about 'love and marriage' at a strip club? Really? Was there a sale on straw men? His argument and examples are flimsy, and his sense of entitlement is implicit to the argument because he pirates what he could afford but doesn't feel like paying for. I'm not alone in having pointed out the problems with his argument and the petulant nature of his tone which leads to these conclusions. I'm only saying that considering the tone of the post, I would never expect to make much money off of this kind of 'potential consumer'. I'm fairly convinced he'll find another excuse to pirate or another demand to make even if I met all of his. He basically admits to pirating 'World of Goo', a DRM free indie game, because 'It is not worth 20 dollars'. Let me reiterate this a different way - a game that took a team of two indie devs[1] just under a year worth of effort to create, which they released without DRM[2], is not worth the price of a decent dinner to this guy. Nevermind that it will provide several hours of entertainment, it's not worth the…

Except this isn't true either and I would suggest it's nothing but pandering. People pirate because they're cheap, the amount of people that pirate because of DRM is tiny and anyone who takes part in these online communities (gaming.reddit for example) will be part of the small small group that pirates for "moral" reasons. 2DBoy, creators of World of Goo, a game that had 0 DRM and was available, as Gabe says, to EVERYONE without any conceivable inconvenience (beyond the need to purchase) reported over 90% piracy rate: http://2dboy.com/2008/11/13/90/ Steam have very high purchase rates because it's a convenience, most definitely, Steam is a fantastic convenience and encourages me to purchase some games much like it encourages others, what it does not do is encourage pirates to purchase instead. It seems most people that share Gabes view are just hoping if they say it's true enough then bad DRM will go away... Minecraft for example has huge piracy rates, yet it's available to anyone (same purchase requirements as Steam) and there's no real DRM, there's no conceivable justification for pirating Minecraft beyond "I don't want to pay" yet people do it...

This old chestnut. First, before I get started on the piracy bit, there are a few things in this article that are cliche and offputting. The minute I saw these things, I was immediately unsurprised about their app's lack of success. "GAMEized is one of the newest game development agencies to take the industry by storm, and we did it through an innovative marketing approach and solid game development" There are very few iOS developers who are taking anything by storm. Rovio, Andreas Illiger, Newtoy...those guys took the app store by storm. The developers of the other 400,000+ apps in the app store...not so much. Simply saying something is "innovative" or "solid" does not make it so. What is "innovative" about GAMEized's marketing approach? What is it that makes their development so "solid"? If it their approach was so innovative, surely I would've heard about their game before this article showed up on HN... "After several hours of research and development..." Why is it that there are so many iOS devs that think that they can spend "several hours" doing anything and expect anyone to care? Name me one great app that has come along and was profitable as the result of "several hours" of work. Found one yet? Exactly... "FingerKicks is an exciting and addicting game we developed for all iOS platforms (iPOD, iPHONE and iPAD). It’s simple to play and exciting to master" This is how damn near every single app developer describes their app these days. If I see the words…

Oh, that's a different point. First, I'm not sure you can stop piracy. 2dboy tried releasing games with DRM and without DRM and saw the same rate of piracy with each. Then even if you could stop piracy, it would barely make a difference to revenue. They calculated that they could make 1 sale out of every 1,000 pirates. http://2dboy.com/2008/11/13/90/ And that's for a really good indie game like World of Goo. One thing I don't see anyone mentioning here is whether "Gentlemen!" is any good.

World of Goo did the same thing a while back. They made an incredible amount of money and reached a large amount of people. Yes, many people paid 1 cent, but they still made more than they would have otherwise. Read the attached article, it's their response to their sale: http://2dboy.com/2009/10/19/birthday-sale-results/

> I pirate because I would never be afford all the things I want or use. That may apply for you, but seems empirically false. Take, for instance, 2D Boy's recent "Pay Want You Want". The plurality[0] chose to give $0.01 (the lowest possible amount). I really have a hard time believing that $0.01 was anywhere near the maximum of what the average customer could afford, or valued the game at. As long as it's without consequence and easy enough, people will take what they can. Leave a six-pack of beer in a communal college dorm and see how long it lasts, if you don't believe me. [0]: http://2dboy.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/histogram.png

Interesting graph - http://2dboy.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/histogram.png Observe skews at multiples of $5 - 5, 10, 15, 20 These tell you how people look for easy anchors to decide pricing. When there is no guidance, easy to think of $5 than $6.21

As it's a series of articles going through the various World of Goo-versions they had before the final, there's no need to go throug TIGSource, just go directly to 2DBoy.com. More specifically http://2dboy.com/category/world-of-goo/page/2/ for the beginning of the series.

The article lacks any real point--the only solid point he's making is, "if you write software and charge money for it, your software will be pirated." He then implies some software "deserves" to be pirated, by claiming World of Goo falls outside that category (because it isn't from the "bowels" of a "faceless EA-Activision franchise sweatshop"). Many independent game developers don't view piracy as black and white. I would be interested in reading an article where someone makes a hypothesis one way or the other, and backs it up. This article isn't that. And, for the record, the amended World of Goo piracy rate is 82%. 2D Boy mentions that in an update on the very same blog post Jeff links to, but I guess that would mean he would've had to read beyond the title to notice: http://2dboy.com/2008/11/13/90/

Is there a mailing list for Linux users who want to be updated when a linux version comes out? Edit: Nevermind, kind of found it http://2dboy.com/mailman/listinfo/announce_2dboy.com

If you haven't already bought it, you should do so right now. A downloadable, DRM free version is available at 2dboy.com -- support these guys. Btw, this game was supposed to have a 90% piracy rate.. Though their method of calculation wasn't very scientific.. http://2dboy.com/2008/11/13/90/

Yeah, it's referring to World of Goo. It was one of the most enjoyable games I've played in years. If you want to try it out before you buy, there's a demo that spans the first chapter/~25% of the game here: http://2dboy.com/games.php

There's a good demo at their site http://2dboy.com/games.php (you can also get it through Steam). The presentation is very slick (atmospheric, with a dark undertone reminiscent of the original Charlie and the Chocolate Factory), and the puzzles are interesting and varied.

My responses will focus on the PC market, mostly. The console market is a different beast altogether. > Instead of relying on a single instance of a product making money for years to come, focus more on new games Sell it at a loss, make it up in volume? Right. > or in-game content sales. That's exactly what I DON'T want. Dragon Age has a guy in your camp with the "I have a quest!" marker above his head. Except it's a paid quest. And you can't make him go away. Die. And what, exactly, is supposed to prevent someone from pirating in-game content sales? DRM sucks. But so do people. LGP is a small company fighting the good fight. They have clear evidence that piracy is taking place. There are only a few things they can do about it: - Suck it up and take it. This is the route that most indie/small companies take. Estimates at the piracy rates from other indie devs seem to be about 80-90% [1][2][3]. - Build DRM like 2k games, using SecuROM and like technologies, that make users despise you. This option is expensive in both money and reputation. - Build DRM like Steam or Stardock's Impulse, where the pain of DRM is offset by the community aspects and other perks. This option is expensive in money, but the reputation damage is minimal. - Do something quick and simple. LGP seems to have implemented this option. I posit[1] that DRM does reduce piracy. It cannot stop it, but it can reduce it. Most vendors try to come up with a 100% solution that turns out to be an 80%…

^^ That quote is from this page: http://2dboy.com/about.php

Sounds like 2DBoy: http://www.2dboy.com/about.php